BiB results for healers


#1

I know there was some talk on Discord about this but instead of pinging you there I thought a forum post would be more useful.

Have you got any closer to working out how to include, or weight, deaths into the results?

These are from my priest, with this addon export.

Summary

$57;US;Dath’Remar;Kluey;;5;1;110;13:785,12:800,10:800,14:780,4:800;2;.s1;22;2131112;883,1,1,1,1,1,1,1,1,1,1,1,1,1,1,1,447,34,186,1,1,1,80;1,1,1,1,1,4,4,4,4,4,4,4,4,4,1,1,1,1,4,1,1,24,1;152043b1477b3336b3610,152056b1472b3528b3610,142519b1547b3337b3573;1,1739,35,9,-894,-1,7,1,0,1,0,1,0/2,844,41,2,-893,2,4,1,0,1,0,1,0/3,844,42,2,-893,-2,5,1,0,1,0,0,0/155852b1487b3336b3610,846,32,12,-892,5,-7,0,0,0,0,0,0/152056b1487b3528b3611,850,39,6,-890,2,-3,0,0,0,0,0,0;.s2;23;2121222;834,1,1,1,1,1,1,1,1,1,1,1,1,1,1,1,497,34,189,1,1,1,77;1,1,1,1,4,1,1,4,4,4,4,1,4,4,4,4,1,1,4,1,1,24,1;136717b1617b3337b3536,155854b1492b3336b3610,136771b1597b3337b3418;1,1739,32,12,-214,-726,3,1,0,1,0,1,0/2,893,39,-3,-937,11,-7,1,0,1,0,0,1/3,897,32,12,-935,1,-5,1,0,1,0,1,0/137327b1592b3528b3536,895,41,3,-214,-722,2,0,0,0,0,0,0;.s3;24;2211232;764,1,1,1,1,1,1,1,1,1,1,1,1,1,1,1,568,34,192,1,1,1,74;1,1,1,4,1,1,1,4,4,4,4,4,4,4,4,1,1,1,4,1,1,24,1;152055b1472b3528b3610,137471b1612b3337b3536,152056b1487b3528b3611;1,1739,42,2,-1008,-4,-4,1,0,1,0,0,1/2,972,39,-3,-998,-6,7,1,1,0,1,0,0/3,961,35,3,-1003,2,-1,1,0,1,0,1,0;.q1;40585s11;88283s16b738x152043y13z-9537;4765s2b874b1725b199;786s8b-1944b216b1720b8;2922s1b-1949b221b1529b81;72s6b-1806b1725b199;1717s9b-1924b1725b81;7877s13b-1906b1824b226;4639s12b-1751b1819x9061e5427;140s3b-171b171;368s15b-2143b2041b83;1s10b-3571b1447b2041b83;2s7b-2124b2041b83;1s5b-2139b2056b82;2014s14b603;.q2;128825s16b739x136717y19137z-19083;3620s6b1072b1819;1974s8b-2038b216b1720b8;2933s5b-1939b1740b81;1778s9b-1806b1725b81;12170s10b-1786b1705b199;11s12b-1924b1725b198;335s11b-1724b1819x14809e5427;319s2b-2128b1835b274;189s15b-2124b2041b83;2s1b-2124b2041b83;1s7b-2124b2041b83;2s3b-2114b1839b275;130s13b-2124b2041b83;1883s14b602;.q3;128827s16b740x152055y-14584z14585;3610s3b1071b1819;1196s2b-2018b1725b199;325s17;461s8b-1944b216b1720b8;113s11b-1924b1725b199e5423;2820s5b-1939b1740b81;61s6b-1806b1725b199;1717s9b-1924b1725b81;12516s12b-1607b1819x-476e4;316s13b-2143b2041b83;192s15b-2124b2041b83;1s10b-3571b1447b2041b83;1s1b-2134b1859b274;1s7b-2123b2041b83;2015s14b602;.r;_;.inv;4305;1;0;32;1;0;3814;1071;2292;1146;1385;0;1;0;293;941f19;1027;2089;71;177;19;1306;426;0;1;0;0;0;0;5;6;0;1;0;0;0;1;0;0;0;0;2;0;0;1;1;105;580;129;1;0;2;5;640;0;0;4;368;2172;1012;610;2515;2555;1934;773;42;107;99;0;0;3795;819;1903;925;0;1;3527;953e846;732;77;5923;374;546;0;0;0;797;5;2391;14248;550;1354;6276;0;1;0;1;0;1;1;0;3179;0;0;3696;12476;3599;6858;42;1;6;1;0;0;0;0;0;0;0;0;2;1;564;0;0;0;0;0;0;0;0;867;93;1;2;900;0;0;0;0;0;0;0;0;0;0;0;0;0;1;0;0;0;0;0;0;0;0;0;0;0;0;0;0;0;0;0;0;0;0;0;0;0;0;0;0;0;0;0;0;0;0;0;0;0;0;0;0;0;0;0;0;0;0;0;0;0;0;0;0;0;0;0;0;0;0;0;0;0;0;0;1704;1;1;0;0;0;0;0;0;1;324;0;0;0;0;0;0;0;540;3;491;123;1;76;1446;2086;2591;1327;1;1851;0;313;0;0;0;0;0;3;0;0;1347;1250;626;18;154;11;1;4;29;1;1;1;1;334;96;5;0;0;34;9;3;142;3;148;1;168b740x152055y-14584z14585;41b-2x-13y13z-9537;1353;2215b2721b171;1b-1819b1819;10b-171b171;3b-171b171;5b-171b171;1117;61b-2018b1725b199;340b-77b171x-12299e4582;204b-2008b1715b199;318b-1929b1730b81;37b-1806b1725b199e-5;2122;116b-1924b1725b199;531b-3495b1571b196b1529b199;26b-1944b1936b8;14b-1949b221b1529b81;72b-1806b1725b199;83b-3493b1569b1725b199;146;359;3;3;285;0;1084;416;10;6;1;347;17;19;395;745;114;159;47;465;218;993;1110b-1725b1819;33b-3588b1550b1936b8;2536b-2024b1824b226;156b-2065b311b1720b34x-1;1b-2060b1834b226;1b-2055b1829b226;1b-2065b2031b34;1b-2065b2031b34;1b-2065b2031b34;339;52;148;3860;0;1;180;38b-103b171;155b-3587b1449b1844b275;2b-2124b2041b83;1b-2134b1859b274;3b-2123b2041b83;7b-2139b2056b82;0b-2123b2041b83;8b-2124b2041b83;94b-2124b2041b83;39;60b-3571b1447b2041b83;3b-2139b2056b82;266b-2123b1850b273;13;2;176;11b-151b171;62b-2153b1859b274e0;239;1;1;1;88b-2123b2041b83;170;1;366;620b374b9;2b-11b2;1675b-2498b1849b274$

BiB result: 1741467 HPS Ally Deaths: 2.78
Equipped gear*: 1664879 HPS Ally Deaths:0.63
*you need to press auto gem/enchant.

Personally I’d go with fewer deaths, I’m not really fussed about ranking.
Also the BiB is 8 ilvl lower, bringing my health down just over a quarter of a million. Being an alt I’m not brilliant at it, so I like the extra HP to help me live through more small errors.

Deaths brings me to another question.
I know the script uses battle ress instantly and with no limit, how hard is it to change it so it doesn’t use more than what we can in game?
Sure the HPS number will go down, as you’ve got less targets, but having high HPS but everyone dying multiple times isn’t really useful. That happens if you up the M+ setting too high, I’d rather a warning saying everyone died. Maybe an option to continue?

Also on the topic of deaths, in the M+ script what happens if the first death is yours?

Finally there was a bit of talk about a Blender setting for healing, so we can do some damage instead of virtually twiddling our thumbs waiting for damage to happen. It would be very useful for the M+ script but would probably need a separate/different script from the Moroes fight it’s currently based on.
I understand the reasoning behind choosing that fight but outside of that situation the gear recommended would be quite different for the rest of the dungeon and even different bosses.


#2

I missed this post last week.

My inclination would be to do some work on the rotation to make it such that it won’t result in higher HPS if more allies die. That is going to be the simplest solution to this problem.

We have given some thought to creating some sort of gear-ranking metric that incorporates ally deaths directly - it’s just one of those things that is very difficult, as we’ve learned from the tank sims.

If we left allies dead when there are too many deaths, the volatility (variance) of the simulation would skyrocket, and result in healing sims being even slower - maybe too slow to even really make gearing strategies. It makes more sense to just do sims of situations that you can actually handle, in my opinion. We could add in a setting for people who want to mess around with it, but I don’t think it’ll be particularly useful or insightful for a number of reasons. One being the volatility, two being that when a lot of people die, usually you end up just wiping anyway, or else the fight takes a really long time. I’m not sure that the results would really be that useful for simulating “wipes” more or less.

We have a lot of ideas on how to improve healer gear ranking going forward. For healers in particular… one idea we have thought a lot about would be to create “benchmark” scripts instead of specific bosses. These would test a healer’s efficacy on specific situations like: do as much AoE burst healing as you can in 30 seconds. Or, do sustained heavy raid healing for 45 seconds. Or, heal a tank through massive damage for 30 seconds. Then we could use the results of those types of sims to give people some more flexible options with regards to how they want to gear. The main problem being that you would need some sims of full fight durations to give any value to mana-saving trinkets/talents.

In this particular case, I think that the logic in the rotation for the T21 set bonus is inadvertently resulting in a more optimal healing pattern. The heavier use of Prayer of Healing is doing more HPS, but allowing more people to die compared to heavier use of targeted patch heals with Flash Heal. I think an adjustment to the rotation could solve the problem.


#3

I agree about there being not much benefit to simming wipes.
Occasionally they might result in a first kill with a Holy Paladin - in a bubble, taunting - while the last DPS kills the boss but it’s not worth trying to sim it and totally useless for choosing gear with.

Can you get the sim to just abort the run with an error say something like, Way too many characters have died, aborting now so you can change gear or lower the difficulty so we waste less time. I’d prefer something like that so I can loot at what I’ve done wrong in setting the sim up, it would also be nice for tank sims too, You're not geared well enough for this fight, aborting now so your virtual tank doesn't get demoralised from dying repeatedly.

On that note I was playing around with different options with my priest, noticed that it was using Potion of Prolonged Power 30s into the fight! Given that one lasts a minute a pre-pot would cover that instance, I assume it would just use it again next time the condition was met.
I swapped it to a Leytorrent Potion and simmed the same duration, the result was lower HPS and less deaths. Doing nothing for ten seconds supports the lower HPS, perhaps the lower deaths is because of a mana problem?

I wasn’t sure so I went looking in the results, then worked out I don’t know how to tell if I ran out of mana or not. Either I’m looking in the wrong place or it’s something which could be added?

Adding DPS to the healing profiles.
I remember someone joining the Discord server and asking about Cat Weaving for the resto druid script, you said that the simulator handles doing damage but that you hadn’t added the damaged spells or logic to the rotations. Instructions were given on how to do it and I remember him having some luck with it but I couldn’t find it when I searched Discord.

I keep getting lost when I try doing this, I’ll try and find time to specifically work on it.
I’m open to suggestions about how to do it, should I look at a DPS spec for that class or look at the Disc Priest one and try and adapt it?

The Moroes M+ gearing strat is great for beating that fight but I can change gear in a dungeon and, normally, the trash isn’t as bad as that.
I understand that it’s really hard to balance this out, given many of the stupidly high runs are set up with multiple AoE stuns. I’m not at that level, I don’t think a very large percentage of players are, but a way to help me gear to get through Teeming, Fortified weeks at a high level would be nice.