Are you all sure AMR is working?

Running BiB, no best gear in my bag. Have pawn addon and they say I have several pieces that are 15 to 20 percent increase from what AMR says I have. What going on? No wonder I can’t get people to want to join my N crucible raid.

Is it possible for you to post your Export string form the game add-on, please?
As I’ve noted here on several occasions; no one optimisation source is ‘right’ & the rest ‘wrong’… they’re different.

When you follow the advice of Pawn & equip their recommendations, have you then un-equipped them & compared what AMR says…?

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Pawn uses stat weights (i.e. simple values to determine the value of each single point of stats) to evaluate how strong an item is and compares this to your currently equipped item.

This causes a couple problems though:

  • Stat Weights can’t show interactions between stats (i.e. having some of stat X might be better than having none even if that stat is relatively weak by itself).
  • Stat Weights can only be correct if you’ve calculated them for your specific setup, i.e. talents, azerite traits, essences and current equipment.
  • Stat Weights are not a reliable way to say if item X is always better than item Y, especially if those have different stats.

AskMrRobot tries to look at the overall picture and recommends the most optimal setup looking at all those details while using an exorbitant amount of simulations to achieve that. Gearing in WoW has gotten so ridiculously complex that even this can not guarantee to get the single most optimal solution though, which is why AMR can only guarantee to be within a couple percent of the very best combination.

As eighjan mentioned it might be possible to give a more specific answer if you’d provide your addon export string so someone else can take a look at your secific situation. 15 to 20 percent difference does sound like a lot.

But all of that might not even have any correlation with your problems forming a group. Crucible is a difficult raid where one simple mistake can wipe the entire raid even on normal difficulty and is almost 2 tiers behind the current content.
Due to this even the items available there are no longer interesting as you can get better items for much less effort…

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ok well I open myself for ridicule by doing this here it is.
79;US;Ysera;Autoattakk;The House of Funk;12;1;120;61;13:56,15:800,12:175,1:175,3:175;2;.s1;25;2212221;;.s2;26;2131333;0.12.1_1.27.1;.s3;27;0000000;;.q1;133229s17v120b5473b1e5950;24809s5b-3882b3183b11b630a272935a7467a-13465a1657a-4616;3s1b-3839b3198b11b628a8957a4741a-13689a4450a-4459;34s2b-3846b3361b7b878;287s11b-4247b3217b218e-11;950s10b-3430b3211b19b206x153712;3966s9b-3411b3186b342;105s8b-3548b3209b339;500s16b-3538b3199b339;1563s6b-3603b3261b19b324x-2;66s15b-3604b3264b13;9s7b-3277b3264b13;146s13b-4759b1547b3199b16b1x0;12s12b-3226b3209b16b1x1e0;98s3b-3296b3268b11b36b593a8957a5740a-11738a1659a-4618;2089s14b-3903b3271b18;.q2;157974s5b1607b3168b11b1477a288979a-16044a-8948a4450a-4459;35s1b-4656b3168b11b1478a14697a10304a-9080a-11305a-4616;4s9b-4657b3176b19b1b1047x153712;62s2b-4258b3340b1b1383;287s11b-4749b3217b218e5939;932s15b-3445b3221b4b20b1068x0;45s3b-4298b3203b11b33b1443a8957a888a-7643a8512a-10714;8s8b-6220b1555b3187b222b844;276s14b-4278b3207b7b16x14925;5s13b-3230b3207b7;25s17b-3214b3207b7e23;3613s7b-3179b3179b16b323x-14925;2180s6b-3603b3261b19b324x0;233s12b-3519b3176b20b1047e-21;2697s10b-4363b321b2978b12x0;1714s16b-4757b1446b3296b15b1052e24;.ess;12_1;27_1;.inv;6948;6196;2077b1707;4147;27506;24209;551;14932;7166;9946;4955;1927;5855;1950;2580;303v110b57b48;2876;464b-1777b612b6;40b-502b500b1;3725;123b91;394b-2;2b1b806x137544y18311z-3795p1540p1797p172q-2042q2061q85r-2126r1850r273;423;4460;3887;806;279;1465;198;1215;2786e5428;3316;4801;2;1;1;33;1;30;3;89;0;30;2201;704;6;1;8;11;7;202;43b24b3207b7;1963;102b-3214b3213b18;32b-3226b3208b18;0b-3221b3203b18;101b-4763b1567b3179b17;666;2;13;18;18;12;31;10;10;2;2;11;299v10b-3126b3119;357v0b-3094b3094;523;0;245;437;191;127;1407;1;54;101b-3219b3208b1472;768b-4650b3176b342b730;314;2;1;2002;245;0;316;543;39;0;0;42;82;1;41;47;18;0;0;478b-4379x15496y1196;7;176;155;292;32;5;40;41;24;64b26b3281b16b1051;44;168b-4363b3299b12;9;8;25;97b-3337b3325;5b-3325b3325;85;15;283;2;86;114;1;1;65v0b-3094b3104b6;72;4;0;9;7;119;84;157;17;4;33;212v0b-4762b1669b3087;55;6;15;8v0b-3111b3111

I don’t think you’d get any ridicule here, we’re all just trying to help the best we can. :innocent:

At a quick glance I can only see a couple slots where this could happen, especially your weapon. That would be one of the limitations of stat weights I failed to mentioned above: There is no way to rate the special effect on your ilvl 400 fist weapon as it’s not possible to translate that effect into raw stats and Pawn has to completely ignore that effect. AskMrRobot on the other hand does include those effects into its calculations and ranks items accordingly.

Using the default stat weights for Outlaw included with Pawn, crit seems to be your strongest stat. Just blindly following that advice, you’d think just putting crit into every socket would be the ideal way but, as mentioned in my previous post, stat distributions have gotten much more complicated than that and AMR tries to find the best combination of stats instead of focusing on one single stat.
I’m not sure if this alone would cause differences as large as you mentioned (I’d have to experience that myself ingame) but that’s the most likely explanation I can think of regarding your currently available gear.

In practice, the differences between your lower and higher ilvl pieces should be almost negligible though. You’d most likely not perform any worse using higher item level pieces if this increases your chances of getting into groups.

If you’d like to see more detailed data about different stat distributions you can click the “View optimal stat graph” link to the right. This will open a popup with an overview of lots of different stat distributions an tooltips on each bar to show the exact stats and difference to the most optimal distribution for your current item level.

While not that important in practice, it does show pretty well how close together stats currently are - e.g. in your case, having 2,6k mastery might not be that different from only having 290 mastery. Blindly following stat weights (and Pawn) would show something completely different though.

This does not mean “Pawn is bad, don’t use it” - just take results from all tools with a grain of salt and remember what they can and will tell you. Nothing is perfect. :slight_smile:

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I used the data string you provided & got this as an output:

I have no idea what you saw, but from what @asashdor said, Pawn seems great for on-the-fly ‘how much better is this drop?’ to get a better idea of if it’s worth rolling for, so never a bad thing; AMR work best - again; @asashdor said it above - for ‘group optimising’ gear sets, so there’s no ‘bad’ to using them both & having them play nice together.

Worth noting, too (but you may already be aware), AMR offers a ‘fresh’ Pawn string to import, so you can update your ‘on-the-fly’ list.

GL, going forward…

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You’re very unlikely to cop any ridicule here, just people trying to help.

Crucible of Storms was not popular with many people, now there’s a new raid, with better gear, it’s hard to get anyone to go there.

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