Classic Warrior - Main Hand / Off-Hand Issues

  1. The strongest one-hand from that two weapons (more damage per swing) should be always a mainhand, because warrior abilities scale with main weapon damage like for example Whirlwind. It’s important to do more damage with that abilities with stronger weapon.
    AMR nearly always suggest to use stronger one as off-hand what is a dps drop.

  2. “If you’re dual-wielding and have an on-next-swing attack like Heroic Strike or Cleave queued, any off-hand swings that land during that time will not suffer the dual-wield miss penalty:”
    It’s important mechanic, that allow DW warrior to drop Hit chance for more STR, AGI, AP or CRIT, if he is able to keep ridiculus amount of rage during boss fight and spam Cleave/HS. Most of top DW DPS gearing for 305 + 6% or 300 + 9% for that reason, because they can cast HS/Cleave nearly forever to negate Off-Hand hit penalty.
    AMR nearly always stack more than minimum hit chance for DW, so we think, that mechanic isn’t implemented.

  3. It may be not a bug, but often AMR choosing for us items with Armor Reduction ability. In specific raid party composition amount of reduced armor is so huge, so that type of items are waste of dps, if we can reduce enough of boss armor with other, common debuffs.

  4. We miss some gear in finders from Sunken Temple or Maraudon, what are often used by pre-raid players.

  5. It should be nice to find something like Max Hit Chance or Min Stamina in Customize options. Some DW warriors want to restrict Max Hit Chance for theirs max dps builds, when Min Stamina can be useful for DW Tanks or in PvP.

1.) Our calculations inherently take into account how much the weapon contributes to the damage of attacks like heroic strike and whirlwind. As a warrior, a good chunk of your damage comes from bloodthirst and execute as well, both of which don’t care about the DPS of your weapons. Whirlwind is not really a significant portion of your damage, so heroic strike is really what matters. When you use heroic strike, you do not generate rage with the auto attack it replaces, so the calculation for which weapon is better in which hand has to also factor in the rage opportunity cost of each heroic strike vs the damage it will do.

2.) The increase in hit chance on off hand auto attacks while heroic strike is queued is a part of the calculations. This effect is actually very small.

3.) If you cannot benefit from the armor reduction in your particular group, exclude those items from the optimizer.

4.) Which specific items? Very low level items, except for a few special cases, get filtered out for max level optimization.

5.) There is no reason to set a max on hit - the calculations will only get more hit if it will increase your damage done. We allow people to set a minimum hit cap because some people just really want to hit the cap regardless of losing some damage, so we added that in. We don’t have plans to allow setting a max.

These topics regarding warriors were discussed here at great length when we released the classic optimizer. We revised the calculations multiple times based on the discussion and feel confident that the results right now will work optimally. I do realize that the general wisdom is to put a slower weapon in the main hand… but the only way I could make the optimizer do that is if I were to fake the calculation. I went through the warrior calculations at great length and rewrote it 3 times to make sure I wasn’t making a mistake… I just can’t get an actual result to support categorically putting a slower weapon in the main hand. Sometimes the optimizer will do so, but it depends a lot on the rage available for the fight setup being optimized for.

How weapon can contribute to HS damage if HS buff isnt modified by weapon damage? It’s just a constant portion of damage to the next swing and it will be the same for each wielded main-hand.

Whirlwind is also very important spell during AoE rotation. You shouldn’t neglate it.

Blackstone Ring - AP + hit chance ring. Pre-raid for many classes
Inventor’s Focal Sword - Warlock pre-raid
Gizlock’s Hypertecj Buckler - Shaman pre-raid shield
Mark of Chosen - Good pre-raid Trinket
Trash Blade - Good sword
Albino Crocscale Boots - Feet wit hhigh amount of Agi
Gatorbite Axe and Princess Theradras’ Scepter - notable 2H weapons
Nature resistant gear

Sunken Temple:
Drakestone - healing off-hand
Ata’ai gloves - Healing hands
Dragon’s Call - Epic Sword that can summon Whelps
Rod of Corrosion - Caster staff with some potential

Isn’t that an argument for faster weapons in the main hand? If you have the rage, more heroic strikes is better. The value of getting more heroic strikes far out-weights the slight value of heroic strike queueing, and the even smaller difference between queuing with a slightly slower main hand vs slightly faster one.

Agreed, but we do our optimization for single target only.

  1. That argument means that from HS/Cleave perspective any weapon can be Main hand. Even amount of generated rage is limited and HS still is a rage dump skill, because its the less damage/rage effective skill in our arsenal. It’s just a skill that replace next main-hand auto attack with enchanced one, that doing a bit more damage at cost of rage without rage generation. Because of that faster (and mostly weaker) one hand should be off-hand, because it can swing often and generate rage (boosted with hit chance by HS/Cleave), when slower mainhand cant do this during queued HS/Cleave what is often.

If you will get 2 weapons, that have similar dps, but one is faster than other, then that faster will do more rage.

From Whirlwind perspective only the most powerful from that two should be main hand to do more damage. Especially during AoE
That mean better is to have stronger weapon as mainhand from that two in that situation.

In both situations better is to have weaker, but faster weapon as offhand to generate more rage, when strongerand mostly slower mainhand can improve ability damage done and be less wasted by HS/Cleave.

The reason why people using 2 fast one-hands is mostly by amount of generated rage during single target. Sometimes it’s worth to generate more rage at cost of White and WW damage to spam HS/Cleave, but not always. Some slower 1H are enough strong to avoid that method. Anyway still stronger from that 2 is always a main-hand.

  1. Then why the hell you have multi target option? :smiley:

We don’t have a multi target option for classic.

And, the calculations for our optimizer figure out how much rage you can generate, so once again that is all taken into account when it picks the weapons!