Custom Batch Sim VS Reality (Havoc DH)

Hey guys,

I’m pretty new to AMR (like ~2 months) so I’m already familiar with the basic toolkit (I think). Everytime I get a new item I’m running best-in-bags and then following up with custom batch talents to evaluate the best talent choices.

This week the best talents changed from 223+20311 (I’m using the soul of the slayer ring) to 111+20311. According to AMR Sims I should’ve been able to pull +4% more damage off than with my previous build (which is usually most common for Havoc in ToS).

After finishing the raid with the new build I was pretty disappointed with the results as in average I did less damage and performed worse (although it was a pretty good kill imo) than the previous week with the “old” build, so I pulled my imported my Warcraft Log from the current week and ran another Single Sim to get a more “realistic” Sim of what I should’ve been able to pull off.

(Sorry I had to remove this picture as I’m only allowed to upload 1 picture)

1.121.135 DPS
Error 0.249% (2794.1)
Std Dev: 57395
Run Time: 1.65s
Max 1339409

I’ve then tried to check the spells in order to find a reason why I became worse. The most obvious part is Blade Dance and Potion of the Old War usage. Old War I usually only use once, but it gets simulated with 2 usage so that’s considered (it’s exactly the same with simulation for the previous build), however Blade Dance got me curious.
According to Warcraft Logs AMR Sims of my last weeks build I used Blade Dance only 17 out of 50 times. I couldn’t believe that so made a WeakAuras macro to see if I can increase the times of using Blade Dance. With Warcraft Logs Sims from this week however it tells me 18 out of 53 Blade Dances used, which implies I mostly ignore it, which is not the case actually. I opened the details for that part and there it told me apart from crits, normal Blade Dance was used 20 out of 37 times I the longest period I couldn’t pull the spell off was maybe 2-3 sec, in the whole fight maybe 30 seconds in total (considering the spell having a 10 sec CD I don’t see any room to pull 17x more Blade Dances off.

I’m wondering now, if I’m having any flaws in my approach or setup to Sim my results. Did I forget to consider something or why is the apperently better talent setup actually worse? I want to get better at this whole simulation thing and trying to improve myself so I want to understand what I’m doing wrong here. I couldn’t find any useful guides or videos so I’m hoping to find some answers here.

Best regards,

P.S.: I’m really sorry for the format. I had a really nice appraoch with non-clustered pictures and more links, but apperently new users can only use 1 link and 1 picture so please forgive me.

Hey there - that’s a lot of simulation!

If possible… post a link to the actual log you are comparing to from WCL, and then I can give better feedback on this.

Your approach of using BiB and then using a custom batch to pick talents is somewhat flawed, unfortunately. If your desire is to find the best talent and gear combo in your bags, what you would really want to do is set your talents, run BiB, then simulate the result. Repeat that for each talent combination you want to consider. It would be nice to automate that process, but, right now it is beyond the current scope of the site.

The reason for this is because different talents prefer different stats/items. If you want to do a big custom batch simulation, you would also need to include stat and legendary item variations - and then you get into an absolutely massive simulation. A batch that compares talents is most useful when you know your desired stats/legendary items won’t change with different talent builds.

Hey Swol,

thanks already for your reply. Using BiB already after switching talents is something I should’ve considered, but did not apperently. Currently it tells me the increase in DPS would be 0.06% as it would only exchange neck (-3.5% crit, +2.5% mastery, +2% vers.)

The custom batch you can already find linked in the original post.
Here is my WCL with the new Talents from this week and here the WCL with the previous ‘common’ Havoc build from the previous ID..

Would be good to know if I interpreted my flaws in gameplay accordingly or if I’m misreading something in there.


So, the talent builds are pretty close in potential damage.

It looks like you aren’t getting maximum use out of prepared. It is possible to use VR 13 or 14 times in that fight, and you used it 9 times. So that is 400-500 wasted fury, and a lot of missed chaos strikes. You could potentially have done 10 or 15 more chaos strikes during the fight with perfect play.

Demon Blades is easier to use than prepared, which is probably why it is used more often. You could either go back to the DB talent or practice more with prepared. If you don’t like using prepared/VR, then it’s probably not worth the small potential gain.

May I ask one last thing? Did you see that in my WCL or AMR Sim (based on WCL)? I can’t find Prepared/VR usage vs potential in AMR so I’m curious.

In the amr report you can see VR on the ability breakdown. There is a “uses” column which shows the total uses.

If you expand the “other” category you can see fury gains by source.

WCL shows the VR hits but it doesn’t show fury gains from prepared.

Apperently I was simulating a wrong link that’s why I couldn’t see VR -_-

You said I used VR 9 out of 13-14 times. Re-enacting your statement I can see that you compared my WCL (9 times) to AMR Spells (13.4 times). I thought using my WCL to sim actually re-creates the log in AMR so I just payed attention to AMR Spells Use vs Count as the description reads “Number of times that the spell was directly used by the player” and “Number of times that the spell had the opportunity to do damage/healing” and apart from VR those numbers sometimes differ (e.g. Chaos Strike WCL: 57, AMR Use: 73.6, Count: 80.9).

I would assume now that I used CS 57 times. AMR’s Use count is the actual count I could’ve pulled of (73) and 80 times would be the best case scenario with all the procs (e.g. the golden trait that CS can hit again with a 10% chance).
However Blade Dance is logged with 19 casts while AMR Use tells me 17.8 and Count 52.7. How do I use those colums accordingly?

The “used” column is how many times you pressed the button to do that action.

The “count” column is how many times it did damage.

So, blade dance hits multiple times each time you use it. Chaos strike has a chance to hit more than once, etc.

Thanks a lot Swol, you really helped me a lot understanding AMR and my issue better and I really appreciate it!

I consider my post now as closed.