Upgrade finder not following sim result

Character specific Gear
1

I’ve been getting to take my rogue on a heroic run with my old mythic guild, I’ve been further behind than I’d like and this week I got questioned about my gear choices by the other rogue.
I’d been meaning to run some sims as I was sure I was doing something wrong, however I’m confused by the AMR data vs SimC and WCL reports.

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If you look at WCL data you see Salvaged Fusion Amplifier being highest for Subtlety, both Mythic and Heroic show this.
Currently I’ve got that option in my vault but it’s showing up 0.31% behind what I’ve currently got.
This was the biggest question I was asked, “Why are you using Tormented Rack Fragment? It’s shit.”

I don’t think it’s as bad as people make out, it’s doing okay on WCL but there are fewer results with it, probably due to the sheeple problem. I think the, “It’s shit,” sentiment is from SimC.
Now you know, hopefully, that I trust your sim better than the other but they aren’t often this far out unless something odd is happening and in this case I don’t think the Target Dummy boss they use is putting either at a significant advantage so I wondered if the implementation was wrong.

So I went looking and I don’t understand what I found, it’s confusing.
image
That’s your tooltip from my character.

Looking at the Theorycraft Wiki page shows me something I didn’t expect, a five second damage interval.
Does anything else tick every five seconds?
I was quite surprised by that but figured you’d checked it as you normally do.

When I compared a sim result to the raid log the numbers don’t match, although that isn’t the most confusing bit. I’m assuming the tick value doesn’t match because of versatility but didn’t try to work it out as it’s lower in the log so adding versatility to it would make it
The confusing bit is the times it’s ticking in the log, 4, 14, 19, 24.

So that looks like it’s fitting the five seconds you’ve got in the Wiki but it varies a bit and the initial ten second gap is baffling. Also I’ve got no idea why the first display, on the timeline, looks like a debuff but then it switches to just icons for a bit and then starts getting some debuff bars again.
The only thing I can think of is it has some odd reapplication logic.

Some quick sims, note these sims are a little shorter than default as I was trying to match the log to work out what I’m doing wrong. Initially I ran some default duration ones and the margin was bigger.
9386 DPS with Tormented Rack Fragment and Titanic Ocular Gland, my BiB gear.
9393 DPS with Salvaged Fusion Amplifier and Tormented Rack Fragment.
9478 DPS with Salvaged Fusion Amplifier and Titanic Ocular Gland

I also simmed the rogue asking me questions, he’s much better geared than me and plays better!
10692 DPS with the gear he uses.
10623 DPS I just swapped the Salvaged Fusion Amplifier for a Tormented Rack Fragment.

The other thing I want to ask about is the Domination Shard sets. I upgraded my Frost ones as that is what BiB was telling me but apparently the Blood ones are better.
9386 DPS is what BiB recommends.
9544 DPS with BiB gear and me swapping the Domination Shards to Blood.
Technically this is within your BiB error margin, it’s only 1.68% better, but I’ve not found it wrong often.
Not even BiB is choosing the Blood shards so I’m not sure how I’d have worked out they were better without being told by someone using other sources of advice.
I can’t actually use them yet as I don’t have enough currency to level them all to R5.

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PS. Sorry it’s so long, I hope I haven’t made any mistakes as I’m too tired to keep checking, I keep nodding off. :frowning:

2

Regarding the trinkets… those are all pretty close to each other. I could see the fragment not being as popular since you will less often get the full value from it.

The set bonus… those are much harder to deal with in the optimizer with low margin of error. We’re going to be working now on all the new tier bonuses, so that’s going to make it even harder!

We could take a look at that shard bonus and see if the estimate could be tweaked somewhat.

3

Sounds good, 1.5% is bigger than most upgrades I’ll be able to get.

I’m interested in this.

You’re correct about the trinkets being so close, I’m guessing it’s just a quirk in the SimC data and then the sheeple blindly follow it, then good players get good logs with it reinforcing it being so much better and the cycle continues.

4

I can’t think off the top of my head if there is another effect with a 5 second interval… I know there are spells like Doom, which is a 20 second interval. There are a lot of effects that aren’t DoTs but work very similarly and trigger a damage effect every X seconds, and those have intervals all over the place.

5

There’s nothing quite like making new shit up all the time to help consistency. :wink:

6

I’ve now fully upgraded all three Blood Shards.
ddf3695c7ffc40fb97ee9e93ac1e3ba7
With the Blood Shards in BiB wants me to swap to the Frost ones for a 2.98% upgrade but the sim results show it’s 1.5-1.6% lower, depending on Windfury.
That puts the BiB recommendation about 4.5% behind, which is no longer in your error margin. :frowning:

No Windfury.
9,302 DPS BiB gear.
9,449 DPS BiB gear with Blood Shards.
With Windfury.
9,581 DPS BiB gear.
9,726 DPS BiB gear with Blood Shards.

I hadn’t really looked at how much gain there is with Windfury as I have no control over getting it.
I was surprised to see if was 3% higher!

Export in case it's needed.

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7

Instead of a new thread I’ll add on to this one even though it’s a different character.

I did a Legion M+ run and, apparently, got really lucky by getting a Moonlit Prism. One of the people I was playing with said, “That’s BiS for Boomkin.”

So I had a look with upgrade finder, add to my bag as a 246 and it says it’s 1.71% behind my current options for M+ and 2% for ST.
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I ran some combo sims to see where it sits and it turns out it is one of the best options and not behind. The ST recommendation is closer than the M+ one.
Single Target script
Mythicc+ script
Grong heroic script
Zul Heroic script

I ran multiple scripts as I’m not really sure which will be best for Mythic Sylvanas and I was interested to see the differences. I’ve also got different legendaries in there and I should probably make a Circle of Life and Death, even though the better Terror Turkey is telling me to use the Night Fae Celestial Spirits one.

8

Edit.
I just noticed that enchants were set to none for that spec so it was keeping the weapons with enchants already on them.

Another confusing result this time for my rogue.
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If you click on either weapon the list which shows has my new 252 dagger better than either equipped one but BiB isn’t choosing it, even if you unlock Pelagos. I tried that to see if it was because I was limiting it’s options.
With that snapshot I’ve changed the order to see, normally that spec is third.
Swapping the order so it is and it keeps the weapons how the ST spec would have it, using my new 252 and my 246 from Sylvanas.

I specifically had a look at what would happen with M+ at the top as before I chose the 252 dagger, from my vault, I looked at my top three specs to see what it was recommending and it wasn’t showing the weapon as an upgrade for M+, which I thought was a little odd.