WOTLK - Possible bug

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The stats panel on the right doesn’t match in-game. I wonder if this is leading the sim to over/undervalue certain stats (AMR says 20% spell hit, actual is 12.85% for example).

Edit: The above does seem to be true for hit at least. If I set the target hit rating to 20.5% – which is closer to the actual ingame hit cap – the optimizations it recommends are a lot more logical (it doesn’t just gem straight crit anymore).

I think the dual wield specialization talent might also be adding spell hit – I’ll adjust that to only be melee hit.

Everything else seems fine – I don’t know if the in-game character sheet includes the 1% from draenei heroic presence or not, but we include it on the char sheet.

I don’t know what that 20.5% target hit rating number is referring to… but the interesting caps/limits are 17% for spells, 8% for yellow attacks, and 27% for auto attacks when dual wielding. It is common for people to look at these as goals/thresholds… but they really aren’t: they are limits or points at which a bad thing happens, not a good thing (more hit, a really strong stat point-for-point, all of a sudden becomes useless). It is often optimal to be just below these thresholds. It is rarely optimal to go all the way for 27% hit for auto attacks, they don’t make up enough of any spec’s damage.

I don’t know what that 20.5% target hit rating number is referring to

If I set a 20.5% hit target under customize in best in bag.

Quite a few other stats are inaccurate from the in-game character sheet as well. Would it be beneficial to compare them and list those differences?

Sure – I can take a look if a stat seems off.


Thanks for taking a look!

Thanks for the example, these are very helpful.

I think that the char sheet display wasn’t including your character’s base stats, I’ll fix that. The optimizer includes them so this is only a display issue – we have different code for displaying a character sheet and doing calculations on the server. This would impact the displayed value for str/agi/sta/int/spi, health, mana, crit, and dodge/parry/block chance.

The difference in hit I think is due to dual wield specialization talent and heroic presence – the in-game char sheet must not include them? Also your locked setup has 2 less hit rating than your equipped setup, which would account for the rest of the small difference.

The difference in attack power is mainly because the char sheet was not including the bonus from the mental dexterity talent.

(As mentioned, all of these issues only affect the UI, not the optimizer, which already handled all of these correctly.)

The only two that I can’t seem to get to match as closely as I would like are Mana and Melee AP… I end up with:

11890 mana
3033 melee AP

For mana… it’s possible that I have the incorrect base value – those are tough to find online and I don’t have a lvl80 shaman to check in-game. If you remove all of your gear, how much mana and intellect do you have?

I’m not sure what would be causing the discrepancy with attack power… the final strength, agility, intellect I’m calculating are:

129 str
633 agi
520 int

You have 1611 AP on gear, and shamans should have a “base” attack power of 140 (player level * 2 -20). The sum of those is 3033, so I’m not sure where the extra ~229 AP is coming from… it’s possible that I have the incorrect base strength, agility, and/or intellect values for a level 80 shaman. What are those values if you have no gear or buffs?

Target spell hit cap for space goats is 341 rating (13%). My gear is currently 339 rating and the in-game char sheet shows 12.92%. 17% is the cap, so I think you’re right – in-game doesn’t show Heroic Presence. 13% + 1% (Heroic Presence) + 3% Misery/imp FF = 17%

Naked base stats (standard spec):
HP: 8140
Mana: 6111
STR: 121
Agi: 71
Int: 133 (+5 from something)
AP: 512
Spell Crit: 8%
Melee Crit: 8.77%

Naked base stats (0/0/0):
HP: Same
Mana: 6036
Str: Same
Agi: Same
Int: 128
AP: 332
Spell Crit: 2.97%
Melee Crit: 3.77%

Full Gear (0/0/0 - no offhand):
// Hit
Rating: 315
Spell: 12.01%
Melee: 9.61%

// Crit
Rating: 587
Spell: 18%
Melee: 22.68%

// AP
2443 (850+1593)

Full Gear (Standard Spec - no offhand):
// Hit
Rating: Same
Spell: Same
Melee: Same

// Crit
Rating: 587
Spell: 23.12%
Melee: 27.68%

// AP
3261 (1509+1752)

Sorry for being a pain, I just want the tool to be as good as possible (selfishly of course :wink: ). The BiS / BiB / Upgrade finder / Gemming suggestions has some really odd results that sim as a downgrade on the wowsims simulator.

We will of course work out any bugs that might be floating around, but I wanted to mention that comparing what we do to an open source simulator should be done with caution. We are talking about very small differences - simulation is not really that great for measuring things at that scale. Who knows how accurate the simulation is? It is actually impossible to quantify the error present in a simulation. Simulators are best suited to creating large sets of data and identifying trends. Unfortunately they are used in the wow community to compare single data points.

Totally agree! I don’t assume that the popular sim used by the community is perfect just because it’s popular. I’m just trying to help identify any bugs that I can find/see as a user. Eventually when gemming/regemming isn’t so expensive I’ll compare each recommendation in-game to see how it works out.

Don’t get me wrong – I’ve been using AMR for a very long time and am a big fan :slight_smile:

Thanks for the info – I think the AP discrepancy is from unleashed rage. We only show one of the raid buffs instead of all that give the same buff (in this case trueshot aura). I need to add something to the display to include unleashed rage even if you have trueshot aura deactivated.

Mana seems to match up with those numbers and the formula that I’m using. So I think that’s everything.