WOTLK - Feedback and Bugs


Ran into a few issues with the new optimizer, but overall it’s working great - even most of the gem issues are working so now I can set gem and enchants to none and get the best of new gear and old gear that already has gems and enchants without spending on enchanting non-bis stuff.

Stat Thresholds - Would like to see armor pen as a threshold as this is an important stat for hunters and there is a cap to aim for (1400)
Nobody will be making this cap any time this phase but without doing my own simulations, other resources put it pretty high up in the stat priority.

Enchants - I haven’t reviewed them all but at least one enchant is wrong. According to wowhead: Inscription of the Frostblade is 45 spell power and 15 crit strike rating, not 45 attack power. However the effect on wowhead shows +45 attack power so the issue probably happened when you folks scraped the item data from wowhead. In either case, I can’t find any more info on this inscription so it might not be in the game.

Best in Bags Setup - One thing I’ve always struggled with since classic is setting this up. Is it possible to add a feature that will analyze selected combat logs to determine which buffs and debuffs my raid is using, fight times, pet uptime, etc. and then find a happy balance for each to input into the setup?

I’ll check out that enchant – we read enchant data directly from the game client data files, so maybe that’s a “bad” or fake enchant.

We can add armor penetration to the thresholds. We’ll add it as a percentage though, e.g. you would enter “50” if you wanted 50% armor penetration. 100% is the maximum amount that is useful – going over is a waste.

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Thanks for looking into it. If you don’t mind could you explain the armor pen stat a bit more?
I guess I don’t understand it that well - is the maximum capped for every class? How is the ratio calculated?

Armor penetration is a bit weird in WotLK. Armor penetration rating just converts to a percentage like other rating stats, then stacks additively with any other armor penetration buffs you might have (such as warrior battle stance). The maximum amount of armor penetration you can have is 100% from all sources.

Each enemy has a certain amount of armor. This can be reduced by sunder armor and faerie fire (or their equivalents). This becomes the enemy’s new “base” armor. There is then a formula to determine how much of that final armor can be reduced by armor penetration – usually it is most of it, but not all of it. For example maybe an enemy ends up with 8000 armor after debuffs, and armor penetration can work on 7000 of it. If you had 40% armor penetration, the enemy’s final armor would be

8000 - 7000 * 0.4 = 5200

There is then a formula to calculate how much this amount of armor reduces physical damage that you deal.

It works the same for all classes/specs.

I really need a third stat threshold or at least a priority system.

I am playing a tank. This means I need crit immunity, expertise and hit. Currently I can only put in crit immune and hit. after that it optimizes for stamina, keeping me at about 3% hit

It is rare that the optimizer won’t get you crit immune naturally. You shouldn’t need to force it. If you post a snapshot I can take a closer look.

$11;EU;Transcendence;Urganot;Stranglethorn Gank Squad;1;2;80;-1124:19394,-1098:2150,-1067:23793,-1104:-42000,-729:0,-1085:36367,-68:3290,-1106:5285,-1052:38415,-1031:0,-967:0,-1064:26343,-1011:0,-942:3120,4:11,-530:690,-270:0,-934:3500,-989:10,-529:200,-935:10,-1105:10101,-609:0,-76:1260,-1091:21599,-1090:31903,-1119:17275,6:1,-911:4190,-1073:16440,-81:690;1;.s1;PALADIN;000000000000000000000000000500513520310231133331230152102201202300000000000000;.q1;37186s12;34s14;17s1x41396y-1381e3795;20s11;3s16;119s6x1468y0;256s3x2583e57;47s9e-621;6s7;40s15e-1280;144s13;1767s10x-4035e1283;1040s2;22s17e-1282;6s18;3491s5e1;3s8e1873;.inv;6948;10085;0;4144;664;0;0;0;1864;8837;677;226;0;2;0;0;1;0;0;22;2167;311;0;0;96f8;13f8;1036;4;18;55;27;415;6;53e3234;31;99;280;150;383e60;372;903;125;0;197;84e518;799;5;5;357;150;205;964;56;46;130;90;54;18e14;10;6;8e50;108;161;484;115;0;3;0;63;55;212;8e-631;5e570;1964;1;1;1;4027;148241;.gly;56416;57947;63219;63223$


To create a snapshot, press the “help” link next to the big “Best in Bags” section header, then Create Support Post, and copy the generated snapshot ID here.

Here you go :slight_smile:

Yeah in that snapshot, you don’t need either of your stat thresholds. The optimizer already gets you the amount of expertise you specify as well as crit immune.

That means it automatically prioritizes crit/exp/hit cap?

Could you take a look at those?
Ret top: 6364c509ccdc4b10bf74b82cd4815a37
Prot top: a443b05576a94136b20327f204a06491

I dont understand why there is an agi/crit damage meta gem when prot is on top and a defense meta gem when ret is on top
Also why does the ret profile have 0 exp if prot is on top?

have run a couple of best in bags where it hasnt taken into account the meta gem requirements when chanign gems and so is not fullfilling the meta gem requirement but still taking into account the Meta gem Stats that are not active

also is it possible to add where we dont want to take a stat IE resilence as a tank

Can you provide a snapshot where this is happening. Press “help” next to the big Best in Bags section header, then Create Support Post, then copy the snapshot ID here.

Is it possible to use custom stat weights? For example, as an arms warrior the optimizer tells me to gem pure crit. And if I were in lower quality gear my feelcraft would agree with this. However if I use other tools (e.g. wowsims/wotlk) my optimized stat weights clearly indicate that I have hit a threshold of armor pen where that is significantly more valuable than crit or strength. I really like the best in bags and gem optimizer tools in AMR, but if I can’t control the stat weights that input to that I find the tool virtually unusable.

edit: snapshot 91e5e0efa2044d23b3f7d9213f96622f


sorry disregard current gear set cant replicate the issue

Is there any way to share the results created with that simulation tool that you mention? I would have to see the results, and specific settings and assumptions that it is making to weigh in on whether the optimizer should match it or not. And I would want to verify that the settings in the optimizer are matching the simulation close enough, e.g. chosen buffs, etc.

I would be most interested in seeing the spell breakdown that the simulation produces for your case and compare it to our own model – that is one of the main things that will push armor penetration one way or the other relative to other stats. Also, have you compared the spell breakdowns produced by the simulation tool to those of a combat log for one of your raids? Do you have a log available that we can compare to both the simulation and our optimizer model?

If you tell the simulator tool to use all crit instead of armor penetration, how much of a difference in DPS does it predict?

With a few more of these data points, we should be able to adjust the optimizer as needed.